Safety Kills

[Transition]

damn Matt you beat me to it. If you have a issue with "conserving ammo" or see someone having to call saftey kills due to that let me know, I will give them a free handful myself, this is a piss poor excuse and in all the years of playing have NEVER seen that one pulled.

[Vidar]

Please don't try to say safety kill once and take out a group of people.

I was joking. Mostly because the concept isn't that hard to grasp. However, because so many people seem to be so unfortunately stupid, any time there's a structure to fight over, there'll be people falling all over it screaming "SAFETY KILL SAFETY KILL SAFETY KILL".

[$tealth]

Perhaps the safety kill isn't working out at the big speedball "operations" but it has it's place in mil-sim.

That's probably because (in my uneducated opinion) more experienced and usually more honorable players attend the mil-sim events. But, for instance, this last saturday at Operation Blacklist, not one person called a safety kill. At least that I heard. Everyone just lit everyone up no matter how close they were.

[Steve]

Please don't try to say safety kill once and take out a group of people.

That's what M-203 shells are for. 150+ pellets in a cloud, with a low enough velocity to not hurt. You can down the whole group at once, don't have to safety-kill anyone, and it's freaking hilarious to boot!

[chapped]

Please don't try to say safety kill once and take out a group of people.

I was joking. Mostly because the concept isn't that hard to grasp. However, because so many people seem to be so unfortunately stupid, any time there's a structure to fight over, there'll be people falling all over it screaming "SAFETY KILL SAFETY KILL SAFETY KILL".

This is an incorrect usage of the "safety kill!"

When it comes to bunkers, trenches or structures might I suggest the use of a hand grenade.
The Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch perhaps?

"... And the LORD spake, saying, "First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin, then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it."

Why are we still discussing this?
Individual event promoters need to be specific regarding the rule of "safety kills".
That's the end all, be all answer to this debate.

[Jester316]

How a safety kill works in a group:

1)A safety kill is the same as putting a bb into a person.
2)A safety kill is not a grenade.


Just as 1 bb cannot kill multiple people, neither can a safety kill. It takes 1 safety kill per person in a group to kill all the people in the group.

[McNair]

I use safety grenades.

[Evil Zergling137]

Then limit safety kill engagement to less than three rounds, or similar. Like Red said, the pain isn't any less at 30 ft. than at 5 ft. with today's average AEG.

Any evidence of this?

At 30 ft your 400fps gun will have dropped into the 270fps range with .20g. FPS drops very very quickly.
With .30g at 30ft you will hit at least 27% harder than .20g.

http://mackila.com/airsoft/atp/

[MBRicochet]

I hate kids running around corners at full sprint screaming safety kill.

Had one do that to me the other week. He ate my burst to center mass at about 10 feet then said "I SAID BANG! YOU DIED FIRST!"

I went off on this kid.

Basically how I see it.

Safety kills are SUBMISSIONS. If you walk up behind some one and you are 5 feet from him, raise your weapon and say "bang."

If they have a chance to actually fight back; shoot it out.

When I come up on some one and their guns is pointed down or something; I raise my weapon and say "bang" if they do not put their hand up or make a move to aim at me I shoot them in the safest and most effective manner possible.

If you don't want to lose your teeth, wear a guard or mask.

If you are going to play; be proper and shoot for center of mass at all times if possible.

Pistols should not have safety kills. The whole point of the pistol is a low FPS CQB gun that allows you to maneuver and fight better at close range. Now if you walk up behind some one and put your pistol to the back of their head and shot them...that's just a tool move, and I do not condone that. I do not like executions.

Running around with a pistol jumping around corners while yelling bang is absolutely horseshit.

Submissions. Not safety kills.

[Orwell]

Here's my conclusion, having read all this and thought a lot.

I completely agree with Matt on his point about distances. I actually really like the idea of a safety kill if you're within a distance where you could hit someone with your gun taking less than two steps.

10' seems like a reasonable distance to me. If I'm ever hosting an event, that's what I'll set. In the meantime, let's all keep our bitching and moaning to a minimum (unless, of course, the rule events aren't clearly defined).

Safety kills aren't optional. It makes sense. The fellow safety killing you is doing you a favor, and giving you the option to not be hurt. Do the guy who's putting himself out there a favor in return and go be dead. In a greater feat of backtracking, I'm going to agree with Mitch. Game, not sport. Fine.

[Ivan Daylovich™]

It's always been my understanding the ENTIRE point of the safety kill is for SAFETY. Why should I not be able to safety kill someone who's facing me? If firing would likely cause an injury why not call safety kill? Why is it ok if I'm behind them, but not in front of them? This makes no sense to me.

Pistols should not have safety kills. The whole point of the pistol is a low FPS CQB gun that allows you to maneuver and fight better at close range. Now if you walk up behind some one and put your pistol to the back of their head and shot them...that's just a tool move, and I do not condone that. I do not like executions.

So what should you do? Not shoot them, not call safety kill?
Another purpose of the pistol is a small, easy to carry, secondary weapon. There are pistols that shoot at (Even over) 400.

[Evil Zergling137]

It's always been my understanding the ENTIRE point of the safety kill is for SAFETY. Why should I not be able to safety kill someone who's facing me? If firing would likely cause an injury why not call safety kill? Why is it ok if I'm behind them, but not in front of them? This makes no sense to me.

Pistols should not have safety kills. The whole point of the pistol is a low FPS CQB gun that allows you to maneuver and fight better at close range. Now if you walk up behind some one and put your pistol to the back of their head and shot them...that's just a tool move, and I do not condone that. I do not like executions.

So what should you do? Not shoot them, not call safety kill?
Another purpose of the pistol is a small, easy to carry, secondary weapon. There are pistols that shoot at (Even over) 400.

I figure, if it is unsafe for you to use your weapon at that distance then you can't safety kill with it, an safety kills should only be used for the submission events. I don't want some bolt at 10ft try to safety kill me face to face when since they only have one shot with a large gun if i simply jump/dive to the side they have a good chance of missing.

[Darius137]

It's always been my understanding the ENTIRE point of the safety kill is for SAFETY. Why should I not be able to safety kill someone who's facing me? If firing would likely cause an injury why not call safety kill? Why is it ok if I'm behind them, but not in front of them? This makes no sense to me.

Pistols should not have safety kills. The whole point of the pistol is a low FPS CQB gun that allows you to maneuver and fight better at close range. Now if you walk up behind some one and put your pistol to the back of their head and shot them...that's just a tool move, and I do not condone that. I do not like executions.

So what should you do? Not shoot them, not call safety kill?
Another purpose of the pistol is a small, easy to carry, secondary weapon. There are pistols that shoot at (Even over) 400.

I figure, if it is unsafe for you to use your weapon at that distance then you can't safety kill with it, an safety kills should only be used for the submission events. I don't want some bolt at 10ft try to safety kill me face to face when since they only have one shot with a large gun if i simply jump/dive to the side they have a good chance of missing.

AP Limits of 400 and even DMR 475 shooting at point blank ranges are safe. The need for a safety kill only really applies to bolt actions or weapons.

[Evil Zergling137]

AP Limits of 400 and even DMR 475 shooting at point blank ranges are safe. The need for a safety kill only really applies to bolt actions or weapons.

That's true.. especially because if you are in the position where you have someone dead to rights you should be able to hit them without lighting up their face.

[Ivan Daylovich™]

AP Limits of 400 and even DMR 475 shooting at point blank ranges are safe. The need for a safety kill only really applies to bolt actions or weapons.

Bullshit. My face has been COVERED in blood by guns shooting under 400. People (myself included) have lost teeth.

...if it is unsafe for you to use your weapon at that distance then you can't safety kill with it...

Zergling, what is the point of a safety kill to you?