Dual Pistols Question

[Jacooni]

Thank you

Another question:

Are Western Arms pistols worth their price? Not only are they expensive, but they're extremely hard to find, and the magazines are also crazy expensive. I wouldn't mind chasing one or two down if I knew that it would be worth it, though.

[Switchback]

On the gun side tho, evike posted these new 1911's that have a built in laser, expensive but very sharp looking.

http://www.airsoftpost.com/product_info ... s_id=34393

Neither expensive or sharp looking; ACU-fail and stainless?
I wonder who makes it...

[DJ]

Dual pistol wielding is the realm of movies and video games........speaking as a real life firearms and tactics instructor you would find it nearly impossible (except at very close range (5yds or so) to hit anything. As for a one handed reload, it is possible to do. It is taught to most police officers in the event of injury. The tactic is slow and clumsy but can be accomplished to save your hide. Two gun reload?...well you are going to have to do them one at a time = death by a thousand bbs hitting you from an opponent with a rifle. Ask youself this question. Why do you suppose the military's primary focus in on rifles? One of my instructors ( Clint Smith) stated this . " the only thing you should be doing with a handgun is fighting your way to a long gun".
I have trained extensively with both, I will pick a long gun every time if given the choice.
enough.....you decide what you want and do it....Airsoft is more about style than function, or so I am told.

Oh and Switchback, Thats not stainless, thats chrome, a pimps gun.....

[Switchback]

Oh and Switchback, Thats not stainless, thats chrome, a pimps gun.....

Funny thing is I typed chrome, then thought, then said "nobody says chrome" and put stainless.

Nice quotation regarding the usefulness of handguns though.

Addition:

The Evike Custom 1911 with Laser Grip is perfect for any situation where quick target acquisition is key. The 1911 itself is a factory upgraded, Full Metal, 1911 with a reinforced outer barrel, chamber, recoil spring guide rod, safety, slide stop, hammer and trigger. The included, Pre-installed Laser Grip is fully adjustable with the use of a precision allen wrench and is patterned in digital camo to help you blend in even better with your surroundings.

1) Except for during the day
2) So it has been upgraded at the factory, as in put together. Stock.
3) Why reinforce the outer barrel? It hardly takes any abuse.
4) I would hope it includes all those parts.
5) Who is using a chrome "pimp gun" and ACU to blend in?

[Payback]

Omg, so frustrating.... The chrome one isn't the only one they offer, I posted it because he said he wanted to mount a laser and this one had one included. Who really gives a hoot if he wants to dual wield pistols or not, If he has fun doing it? unless he's in a full mill-sim GAME, what would it matter?

Just seems that instead of shooting down every idea or question that is not real life comparable, it would be better to realize that some just want to have silly fun. Maybe some bling and a pimp gun and some lowriders would be fun.

I do find it very funny tho that on the description for a chrome gun with a camo grip that it would "help you blend in with your surroundings".

[Jacooni]

Dual pistol wielding is the realm of movies and video games........speaking as a real life firearms and tactics instructor you would find it nearly impossible (except at very close range (5yds or so) to hit anything. As for a one handed reload, it is possible to do. It is taught to most police officers in the event of injury. The tactic is slow and clumsy but can be accomplished to save your hide. Two gun reload?...well you are going to have to do them one at a time = death by a thousand bbs hitting you from an opponent with a rifle. Ask youself this question. Why do you suppose the military's primary focus in on rifles? One of my instructors ( Clint Smith) stated this . "the only thing you should be doing with a handgun is fighting your way to a long gun".
I have trained extensively with both, I will pick a long gun every time if given the choice.
enough.....you decide what you want and do it....Airsoft is more about style than function, or so I am told.

Yeah, you're right, in terms of real steel, there's no reason to go for pistols instead of rifles. I'm not so sure about that being the case with airsoft, though... the recoil is considerably less, magazine capacities are much higher, and the effective range compared to rifles isn't so bad in this case.

I'm also not so sure about having to reload them one at a time. With open pistol magazine pouches and more practice, I'm sure that that method could be done much faster, and that magazines could be dropped into a drop pouch instead of on the ground...

Other discussions show some favor towards pistols as well. Not to try to change your opinion, really, but I'm trying to defend my own

Who really gives a hoot if he wants to dual wield pistols or not, If he has fun doing it? unless he's in a full mill-sim GAME, what would it matter?

Thanks

I don't even see it as breaking realism, when people are using midcaps on AEGs that carry 100+ rounds. If that's not breaking realism, I really don't think that pistol-wielding would be either.

[Rentax]

-On That video-
Total time at "medium speed" = 12 seconds
time it took from mags out to the first pistol reloaded = 7 seconds
time it took from first pistol reload to ready to fire = 5 seconds
Time wasted switching pistols from hand to hand = 4 seconds....
Which means he could hypothetically reload 1 pistol in 3 seconds at "medium speed"
That's 9 seconds wasted screwing around with a second gun.

You are reading these forums with kids asking the same questions and getting the same responses. Things like "leave dual wielding to video games and moves" and "dual wielding doesn't work" or "dual wielding is stupid" and you are coming up with the answer...
I'LL TRY IT! Odd response, but nothing wrong with it. To each their own right rbm33? "Why should WE care" you ask? Well did you miss the simple fact that HE asked? In a forum no less... A place where discuss is USUALLY encouraged. So I'm discussing, (actually some might say I'm bulldozing, but I feel like that's only true because he's still defending his "dual pistols" idea with links to pages full of the same stuff)

-On the POR-
The POR page has some great information on it, and I feel that (like many younger players tend to do) You read the parts you liked and pretended that the parts you didn't like weren't there... He talks about dual wielding at the beginning but then never mentions it again, I see he will have a section on it in the future, but as of right now his article focuses on a single pistol. Does anyone else wonder why?
(PS the answer is NOT "because he hasn't gotten to that part yet")

Basically he's saying the #1 bonus for running pistols only is you are highly effective because you are highly mobile...

Now, think of how much easier it will be when all you have is a Pistol. If you choose to keep your weapon in hand at the ready, you still have one completely free hand, and only a light easy to hold item in the other. Giving you the ability to use your off hand to move brush aside, stabilize yourself on rocks and logs while climbing, keep your balance while running and jumping.

If this was a math equation it would look like this
1 gun + 1 gun = -2 hands = slow down > highly mobile
when you add that second gun, you loose a free hand and much of the ability to move shit out of your way, move quickly through brush, stabilize yourself, etc. so you are less mobile.

The second reason is they you don't have to give your position away as often...

You will have less of a chance of giving away your position using a pistol. Especially when you add into it the high mobility, and ease of movement you get as a pistol only user, crawling into firing position.

There it is again in the second bonus of using a pistol is uses high mobility, and ease of movements is a MAJOR player and as you loose these thing by adding a second gun, you become LESS effective.

Now granted I am coming from a mil-sim point of view. Combat effectiveness is very important to me. I have played Airsoft with rifles and I have played airsoft with Pistols. Switching from one to the other is not as easy at ABC. They are two different languages. Sure any Rifle user can pick up a pistol and get some kills, and likewise a pistol user can take an AEG and and shoot a guy. But when your talking field craft; the way you move through and interact with the environment it's night and day.

-On Items-
Your talking about upgrading the inner barrel of a GBB gun, I'm not going to say it can't be done, but I will say I have never seen an after market extended barrel for a GBB at least not one that long...

You mentioned being quicker with open top magazine pouches, unless you purchase the ridiculously expensive ones (and even then sometimes) open top pouches are a great way to loose those expensive pistol mags. They WILL fall out. Especially if you are crawling through the bushes.

Your talking about getting a ghillie suit for using pistols, which mean you probably don't understand the way a ghillie suit works. Slow movements and sitting still for long periods of time are techniques of the ghillie man. Being fast, mobile, and agile are techniques of the pistols. Working your field craft to get these two to mesh is not impossible, getting it to work well enough to be combat effective is highly improbable.
Just like two mag reloads, possible yes. Effective not really.

I'm not trying to say you can't work at it... I'm not saying that you can't practice, practice, practice. I'm saying from experience dual wielding decreases field effectiveness and combat effectiveness. I'm saying fielding a pistol takes as much time practicing, studying, planning, kitting up, cleaning equipment etc. as your standard rifleman puts in but to do it effectively you're probably going to have to double that.

[Darius137]

If you like a small weapon, but like full auto and the ability to kill things, why not consider a sub gun, like an UZI, a mini UZI or even an UZI pistol?

[BoogeyMan]

One of my instructors ( Clint Smith) stated this . " the only thing you should be doing with a handgun is fighting your way to a long gun".

Amen. Gotta love Thunder Ranch.

[Jewish Ninja]

I'd suggest a KJW M9 over a KWA PTP M9. WE/HFC/Snow Wolf/TM/KJW M9s all use the same parts, so you can find spare mags for them ANYWHERE. Plus, it means you can use this
http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/madbull-235m ... -m9a1.html No fitting required, just drop the beast in and your good to go. I've got one coming, I'll post up more on it after it arrives and I get to use it

[DJ]

One of my instructors ( Clint Smith) stated this . " the only thing you should be doing with a handgun is fighting your way to a long gun".

Amen. Gotta love Thunder Ranch.

Glad to see someone knows who Clint is... LEO? I wondered when I saw your moniker....Too bad he waited til "I hung up my guns" to move his operation to Oregon.

[VogonFord]

Basically, only run two pistols if you're only out for fun. It's like running out with a lightsaber - I don't do things like that because I'm imagining I'm going to pwn n00bs, I do it because I'm having a good time. I also have a natural ability to point guns well, so I can engage a little further than most people with two guns, but it's not a skill that's worth developing. Just do it if you want to screw around, don't do it if you actually want to win.

[CalvinB]

[quote="DJ"Glad to see someone knows who Clint is... [/quote]

Clint Smith is probably my favorite instructor. I've never met him in person but all of the videos and interviews with him are awesome. Why is this? He is all for preparedness, not paranoia. He's all about using the tools you have efficiently and effectively, not about spending $$$ on plastic bits for your AR.

But back to the topic to contribute, to me dual pistols is just like dual rifles, just doesn't make sense. You lose dexterity, the ability to use the sights, recoil control (not a huge deal in airsoft), the ability to reload quickly, have large amounts of ammo and so on. All you gain is double ROF which is still slower than an AEG, and double ammo capacity which is still half that of an AEG. I suggest having a pistol on you, it's a great backup for when stuff hits the fan, but unless you have a reason to grab your pistol, leave it in the holster.

[CommieHunter]

The only downside of using two pistols is that they're hard to reload.

[Matt]

There are some really amazing accurate pistols on the market, but using one as a primary on the field is not very realistic mil-sim, and therefore should not be considered a viable option for most serious games. However, when it comes to speedball, skirms and backyard warz, do whatever you want. But don't expect anyone to take you seriously at a mil-sim event. Some of these events even limit velocity based on the gun type, and apply "real load capacity" magazine restrictions.

If you are going to make yourself a completely unrealistic pistol "because it's Airsoft," then in my opinion you are no better than a retard with a Sniper MP5 with a 5,000 round box magazine attached. I lump just about anybody who bought the NBB MK23 into this category too. Just because it can have the range of the AEG doesn't make it right, and certainly does not make an accurate real-world simulation.

You aren't the first kid with this idea. I've seen it before. It's entertaining for a while but in the end it's still retarded. You'll probably go on a bunch of "mad pistol" runs all while being shot several times, which you won't feel because you had "so much adrenaline," meanwhile the guys with AEGs will be bitching about how they "Shot that tool with the pistols 100 times and he didn't call his hits."

Really it's just like degenerating what we do into a 6 year old's game of cops and robbers.