"The bomb has been planted..."

[Jester316]

Ok, so I'm trying to make this louder. I need help finding a part. Let me describe what I have, and what I'm looking for.

Have:
A circuit that is powered by a AAA battery (1.5v?). When something happens in this circuit, a buzzer is sounded. The buzzer runs off the AAA battery.

Want:
A separate circuit that includes a 9v battery, a buzzer, and is tied into the AAA circuit. When the AAA circuit is completed, I want the 9v circuit to be tripped via the previous buzzer circuit. The 9v circuit needs to be separate so as to not fry sensitive electronics.

I've been told I need a simple relay for this to work (using 1.5v to close a seperate circuit while keeping them isolated from each other). This needs to be as simple as humanly possible. I can't mess with the existing circuit more than adding to the current buzzer circuit. I'll try to get a crappy drawing of what I want up in case that will help.

[Nox]

Yea, all you need is a relay to activate the second circuit. When the signal goes high (turns on) then that trips the relay, which essentially being a switch, turns on the secondary circuit to operate the buzzer.
If you want to make it visually interesting, you can do what I am doing with my project and use an 'ice cube relay' which has its workings in a clear container whch allows the disarming individual to prepare his shorts to be soiled when he sees the thing switch over to trip your secondary cicuit.

[Jester316]

Nox, got a link to the type of relay I need? I'm good on the practical parts, not on the actual parts part (meaning I know what I want it to do, but not what will make it do what I want it to do).

[Nox]

Ice Cube Relay example

Not-so-showy 3 volt DC Relay example

Not-so-showy 5 volt DC Relay example

[Nox]

Also if you dont wanna mess with loose components, you can always buy a Component board and let it do all the work for you. All you need is a 12 volt power supply to get it to work and it will do all the hard work for ya.
A lipo or 9 volt should work just fine.

EDIT:
If you dont wanna dink around with 12v power supply voltage and want to work within battery voltage - THIS relay board only needs 5 volts to run either of the relay blocks, easily accomplished with 3AA batteries.
Mileage will vary since the draw is at 200mah, but if you took an RC pack that was rated that low, you would do fine. (Also found cheap on ebay.)

EDIT#2 - I don't think you're going to find a relay that's going to work on a 1.5 volt circuit, its just too small of a current to make anything move. You might have to think of a way to get it up to at least 4.5v (3 AAA/AA's) to make any of the above relay boards to actually work. 1.5v output will keep it in a 'Low' or off state. Both of the above boards need a minimum of 4v to flip to a High state.

[SkyHawk]

Jester, what type of internal components are you using that it needs to run off of 1.5 volts...

If you can peg it up to 5v or if you do want to do a relay you could use a couple of AND & OR gates to get your multiple wires need to be cut and even have it so if you cut the wrong three the buzzer goes off.

I started to work on a design on this a while back ago and ill see if i still have the schematic at work and can forward over to you.


Kyle

[Jester316]

I'm working with a kitchen timer that runs on 1 "AAA" battery. Any higher voltage frys it. Is there any sort of gate that will work a AAA battery?

[ogrejager]

...I'm seeing triple at it's not even noon.

[Nox]

As far as I knowm there isnt a gate or relay that will switch with voltage that low. You might have to think about a transformer to raise your voltage, that way it would kick out enough to flip it over though.

1.5 volts will barely light up a single LED, so I'm sure you wont get a gate to flip either.

[Savage117]

First of all very awesome prop idea and implementation.

Is it in working order as is, without a buzzer that is? And is this your first attempt at a working electronic device, if so, that is awesome. My first attempt into electronics was getting a motor to turn forward and backward with the touch of a button, and that was from a cannibalized toy, not very sophisticated and not very practical or useful for that matter.

EDIT: This turned out to be a lot longer than I expected, but there are some useful bits here and there and it seems a waste to delete it all after spending an hour, or maybe two on it. Read on if you have the courage.

WARNING!!!! Long and possibly boring post incoming WARNING!!!!

What it sounds like is you've run into a small hurtle, iv been there, its a different ballgame when you try to take already existing circuits and attaching them to other already existing circuits and having them work together without frying one or the other.

A little disclaimer before I continue, I learned this stuff from the ground up using a Electronics Learning Lab from Radioshack, and I feel I know what I'm talking about, to a point, and I will let it be known where my knowledge stops if I get to that point. You take and use whatever knowledge I give here at your own risk and if your device gets fried please don't blame me. If your device does get fried because of me I will gladly help you rebuild it, I have many of the necessary tools and components right here. That said I am also new to this community and airsoft so make your own judgements.

Your first problem is power, that 1 battery your using is going to die very quick depending on how much wiring you've added, wiring adds resistance which means more drain on the battery when the device is running. Also if you add any more devices to it, a speaker for example, even a small one will kill the battery on its first or second go. You can add more batteries to your device without frying it, look up connecting batteries in parallel in Google, by adding a battery in parallel you are doubling your battery capacity but keeping the voltage at 1.5 so you wont fry your circuits!! Make sure you put them in parallel, if you put them in series you will be doubling your voltage not your capacity, and ZZZZZZZZZTTTTTT!!!!, circuit flambe.

I can also tell you that AA's are also 1.5v just with higher capacity, C's, and D's I think are also 1.5v but I have none to look at at the moment, but it will tell you on the battery itself, and I think they can be used safely in your device without hurting it as long as you connect them correctly. Here's a part where my knowledge falters the larger batteries could have higher drain rates and therefore could affect how your device functions, for example your timer may go faster than intended, but you will most likely not ruin your device because you are still running at 1.5v, again assuming everything is connected correctly, you could probably experiment safely without ruining the device here. I would suggest getting a cheap volt meter just to make sure before putting everything together, and check every time you wire the batteries in before hooking it to the main device, when your working with higher voltages and capacities one mistake can cost you the whole device before you can blink, so you have to be careful and patient.

Your second problem is adding a speaker/buzzer, this actually may be easier than you think. Depending on the type of timer you are using, the timer itself may already have a part to it that will act as your switching device. From the picture I can tell that your timer has a digital display, which is good, that means your timer needs a more complex circuit to function. If your timer already has a part to it that dings or buzzes on its own when its done. You can just cannibalize that part or improve on it without too much work, just a little solder here and there, an added wire or two and a new and louder buzzer, and Eureka!!! you have a "fake nogoboom scare the crap out of the bomb disarm er guy device" TM.

I would recommend you just clean up your current device as is before you start with any improvements, for example attaching connectors between each part of the device like the batteries, the timer, and the switches, simple male to female connectors are cheap and easy to wire, and will make taking apart and reassembling the device that much easier, and also make transporting the device much safer and less likely to get you put in jail or your car blown up by the bomb squad. Call your local police department/bomb squad and ask, It looks like Nox has already gone that route, but it may differ for your area, and this is something that will stay with you the rest of your life if you don't follow the right path and end up getting caught. Like DJ said, the Bomb squad will not take this lightly, I deal with the Police a lot at where I work, and when there is a bomb threat or a possible explosive device is found, they go all out, no holds barred, even if it looks like a bag of garbage or a lost bag, so a device that looks close is going to get a lot of attention fast.

I have a couple ideas I'd like to suggest for your "nogoboom" too, if you don't mind. A booby trap attachment would make it even more challenging, just something simple, like a powder airsoft mine attached to a small metal wire inside the box, if the disarm er doesn't pay attention he may take half the people in the room with him out of the game. Or make which wire to cut a puzzle of some sort instead of a guessing game. I am assuming, in the devices current form, the team would have to get some sort of intel that would tell them what wire to cut to disarm the bomb if they are going to disarm it without some sort of puzzle or mind game, and without it going off? Or you could ad a triggering mechanism that would trigger a CO2 canister that will let out copious amounts of powder, making it look like the bomb has gone off, and it would be safe and harmless as long as you use a non-flammable powder, this one may not be such a good idea due to similarities to a real IED and could possible be categorized as one, just as a AEG is categorized, and treated like, a real firearm. You would have to ask your local police department/bomb squad on that front.

That is all I have for now, its late and my brain is working kinda slow. I'm sorry if you already know all this stuff and iv just been running on, and on, and on, but I gathered from your first post and other posts here that you had hit a snag in your electronics skills and wanted some help. Iv been helping my 10 year old Nephew with his schoolwork and teaching some things about electronics so I kinda go into a long winded teaching mode when talking about it. Again I'm sorry.

Another disclaimer, what you are building is close to the real thing in almost every way, you are only some electronic bits and some flammable materials away from the real thing. So keep that in mind as you keep making it better and improving upon it. It will start looking more and more like the real thing, and that wont be too far from the truth, so be very careful. I'm sorry if I put you off your project with these words, but I feel it needs to be said, electronics can be dangerous in a lot of ways, build responsibly.

That is all,
Savage

[Jester316]

Savage, thanks.

As of right now, it does have a buzzer in it (the one that came attached to the timer). However, it is ineffectively quiet. It works just fine, and I have yet to have to change the battery in it. I didn't add extraneous wires, more just extended the existing ones with a heavier gauge (16ga IIRC). The only modular part on it is the cut-able portion, so that I can quickly and easily replace cut wires for the next round.

The way it was utilized before, a team had 2 attempts to disarm the bomb. They were able to cut one wire at a time, and see if they choose right to shut it down. I might offer some intelligence as to what wire is the key, but the 30% chance of guessing right, seemed pretty good at the moment.

I also understand that with a little component switching, this could be made to be devastating. That is why I will not tell anyone how to build it. I was even asked to build multiples for well known members of this community for events, again I said no. This type of project is taken on by the person who builds it. That makes me 0% liable for whatever may happen with that.

[DJ]

I proffered a very generalized caution earlier. This appears to gaining some momentum. Please check with someone regarding the Oregon revised statutes on "Hoax devices", and also Federal statutes. I am not current as I retired in 04. This stuff is a hot potato since 9/11 and the Woodburn bombing. I would hate to see you get in trouble unknowingly. Ogrejaeger can maybe give you some direction. I believe he is currently teaching criminal justice classes. He can at least steer you in the right direction. Most are loathe to give advice on such a topic,due to the nature / possible repercussions. Proceed cautiously

[Savage117]

Im glad I could be of some help Jester, and im glad you are being as safe as you can, id hate to see someone get something on their record for what is a pretty cool electronics project.

My first real electronics project is a remote control airsoft tank controlled by my computer, it doesn't work the way I want it to, cant get the video onto the computer screen, but it does work with the controls, and has about a 600 ft range, can we say UGV , not realy but its fun to dream.

Savage