Store your mags charged!

[Mobius]

100% silicone oil, 10 wt will do nicely.

you can also get the stuff in a can

[User19632]

At the time I was told to not keep gas in the clips.

You don't put gas in clips.....
You can always fix a magazine, if a seal is broken, you can get a new o-ring or seal it with other things. Lube always helps seals, teflon tape (in certain situations) can help as well.

[Decker]

At the time I was told to not keep gas in the clips.

You don't put gas in clips.....
You can always fix a magazine, if a seal is broken, you can get a new o-ring or seal it with other things. Lube always helps seals, teflon tape (in certain situations) can help as well.

+1 for you. I will blame it on the lack of coffee

-D

[Raging Hormann]

Decker, when you got into airsoft, I can make a guess that it was a dealer who told you not to keep the gas in the mags. Generally they would do this so you come back to them with broken mags, or to buy new ones.

[Alex]

if magazines are to be stored for a long period of time, one second of gas, providing that you do a proper "thousand count," inside the magazine is enough to keep pressure on the valves.

This is seriously over complicating things Alex, as well as absolutely unnecessary.

storing half a charge is also okay, though it isn't necessary. a full charge is has opposite effects on a magazine as it will bloat the rings.

Well then, I guess I as well as most of the other people in this thread have bloated rings because I know I keep them at a full charge. Ive also never had any kind of leak or for that matter any other kind of problem and Ive been doing it for upwards of three years.

@first quote
ah, forgive me. my intention was to introduce a way to fill magazines consistantly through simple counting.

@second quote
this is true. magazines that are stored at full charge have a higher chance of the rings bloating. however, i did not address the effects of bloated o-rings. i have no evidence proving that storing airsoft magazines at full charge will increase the chance of a "leak or [...] any other kind of problem," as you have put it. but, i do trust your statement is true as well that no problems have arisen from storing at full charge. however, according to the following sources, (http://www.maapr.com/gas_gun_care.htm), (http://www.tnairsoft.com/forum/viewtopi ... 9d5d295eeb), (http://www.socalairsoft.com/modules.php ... ic&t=30918), (http://www.depot53.com/Tech+Support+++Manuals.html), they reccommend that the magazine be stored inside of the spectrum ends.

in the propane industry, propane tanks, are reccommended not to be stored at full capacity. after the turn of the new century, propane tanks now come with opd valve, which prevent overfilling. this meaning that the tank will release excess gas through a valve if filled over safe capacity of 80%, and 85% being the very tip top limit, (http://www.rversonline.org/02Propane.html), (http://www.build-yourown-home.com/propane-tank.html). the 80% safe limit is to give propane gas enough room to expand as ambient temperature rises. this is very important especially in warmer climates as propane pressure increases faster in its gas form. airsoft magazines do not have the safety valve for reasons i do not know of. without this valve, magazines can be filled to 100%, and if filled over maximum will result in a puff of propane out of the nozzle, in which is a sign to us that our magazine is full and that we then pull out the filling nozzle. by physics, the o-rings will be under more stress from more propane in the magazine and under more when temperature rises, especially in hotter climates, as opposed to a lesser filled magazine. in addition, silicone will add density to the rubber rings and under the pressure of a full charge, they will saturate and expand quicker resulting in the rings pressing harder against the walls. under the conditions of long term storage, though airsoft magazines are much smaller in capacity compared to tanks or even bottles, they are still "tanks" if you will, but without an opd valve, and far less insulation and walling thickness compared in proportion to approved propane tanks of any size. however, in my opinion, despite no reported cases of magazine problems due to storing at full charge, i still strongly reccommend that magazines be stored with a small, yet reasonable amount of gas to get the most service time out of it. science heavily supports this notion.

[Mobius]

Thats what I was looking for, some kind of reasoning behind your opinion.

I see the logic behind what you were/are saying. these things make sense and offer a smart outlook. however there is very little room for the seals inside a mag to expand to and there is a very low likelyhoodthat the rings will bloat.

As far as the thickness and insulation of a mag the average mag wall is around 1/8 of an inch thick. as far as I know thats thicker than any propane tank Ive ever seen.

Finally as I said I have for the past three years kept my mags fully charged and during that time I checked a locked pistol case with my gun and 2 full mags as luggage on southwest airlines when I flew to california. I will admit that I should have emptied them becasue of the drastic elevation/pressure change, however I forgot to and when I arrived I found both mags in normal working order and still charged.

thaks for the insight however. it is a good addition to this thread

[Alex]

ah, please forgive me again. i have looked over my research again and i have found out that i overlooked the thickness of the walls. as stated here, (http://www.globalsources.com/gsol/I/Fue ... 109989.htm), the thickness of the inner wall is 3mm. the outer insulation just serves as a "proof" against the elements. nonetheless, you are right about the magazines having a wall of ~1/8 inches (3.8mm) thick. my little cousin let me have his broken hfc magazine and we took a metal saw to it and cut it open. using calipers to measure the thickness, i best approximated that the wall is 3.4mm at its narrowest point. in proportion to the propane tank, not only is the magazine wall thicker, it can handle much more pressure as the magazine reservoir is very small. it is a very fascinating and very ironic find and for me has brought up the question of why full size propane tanks do not have the generous wall thickness that magazines in the airsoft field have.

[Mobius]

because that would be one extremely heavy propane tank

[Alex]

most definately.

[Jester316]

Alex, you said that they only fill propane tanks 80-85%. My question: is propane under the same pressure when its in a mag vs. a cylinder? I'm not an expert on pressure vs. volume, but according to Boyle's Law, Pressure and volume are inversely proportional. So if you have an normal size propane tank filled to 85%, it seems the pressure would be lower than an airsoft magazine. To me that explains why the propane tank walls are thiner, because the pressure is less. Like I said, I'm no expert on this stuff. This is what clicks in my head, but I've been wrong before. Boyle's Law

[Bubba]

Alex, you said that they only fill propane tanks 80-85%. My question: is propane under the same pressure when its in a mag vs. a cylinder? I'm not an expert on pressure vs. volume, but according to Boyle's Law, Pressure and volume are inversely proportional. So if you have an normal size propane tank filled to 85%, it seems the pressure would be lower than an airsoft magazine. To me that explains why the propane tank walls are thiner, because the pressure is less. Like I said, I'm no expert on this stuff. This is what clicks in my head, but I've been wrong before. Boyle's Law

Boyle's law would only apply if the amount of gas in each container were the same. (When the wiki article you linked to is talking about moles, that's what they're referring to.) Much less goes into the magazine than is in the propane tank.

In fact, since you're using the pressure from the propane tank to fill the mag, the only way you could get the pressure inside the mag to be more than inside the propane tank would be to change their respective temperatures after filling.

[Jester316]

Alex, you said that they only fill propane tanks 80-85%. My question: is propane under the same pressure when its in a mag vs. a cylinder? I'm not an expert on pressure vs. volume, but according to Boyle's Law, Pressure and volume are inversely proportional. So if you have an normal size propane tank filled to 85%, it seems the pressure would be lower than an airsoft magazine. To me that explains why the propane tank walls are thiner, because the pressure is less. Like I said, I'm no expert on this stuff. This is what clicks in my head, but I've been wrong before. Boyle's Law

Boyle's law would only apply if the amount of gas in each container were the same. (When the wiki article you linked to is talking about moles, that's what they're referring to.) Much less goes into the magazine than is in the propane tank.

In fact, since you're using the pressure from the propane tank to fill the mag, the only way you could get the pressure inside the mag to be more than inside the propane tank would be to change their respective temperatures after filling.

See, I said I wasn't an expert. This is why I'm not a chemistry major. Thanks Bubba for the clarification.

[pro_james2000]

1. I'm buying a TM G26 (for 150 bucks good price or no?) any suggestions on any maintenance that I should do?

2. What type of gas is better to use propane or HFC22?

3. What does HFC22 mean?

4. What do you mean by a "charged" mag?

[pro_james2000]

how far will a 320 FPS shoot? conversion in Ft./yrds.

[Junto]

We have 2 original TM SOCOM mags that don't leak because they are never empty. TM SOCOM mags have a lifespan of a month or two... I'm still amazed.