Re-enacting S.W.A.T.

[Reese]

And one more click............... DONE!

One plane ticket to Germany. That is what American airsoft needs to be. Staged or not.

Clearly you've never been to a CQC tournament.

CQC is a small part of airsoft. There needs to be more MOUT, but not CQC/SWAT style... there isn't enough organization, uniformity, etc. in regular airsoft. I personally don't like any airsoft that is restricted purely to close quarters... but that is because I have never had good experiences (people being chuckleheads, etc.) I am sure CQC would be fun to attend.

It appears you are impressed by a few fancy pictures. While I have no doubt these gentleman have the skills, it is their kit loadout which creates the "wow" factor, not their room dumping ability.

I would also like to have a more open environment while running events, especially with CQC. We use the term loosely because the competitions do include outdoor to indoor and different ROE's, but having MOUT facilities at your disposal is quite a challenge to line up regularly.

From the jist of your initial statement though, I believe the competition (read reenactment of LE/MIL situations, with competitors dealing/reacting to them with their person tactical toolchest) aspect may be something you are after at least is some depth simply due to the detail of the events.

Yes, that is precisely what I'd like. Putting a ton of detail into events. A lot of times (especially in my region, where airsoft isn't big), it turns into plain old force on force shooting... which is fine for some fun, but if there is no purpose or mission, it turns into paintball.

Missions where you have to think, use tactics... sometimes events that involve more brains than straight shooting. Instead of red vs. blue... add a third group in there, and require both sides to attempt to get them on their side. If there was an airsoft mission similar to the Special Forces Robin Sage exercise in the SFQC, it would be amazing. But that isn't for this thread.

Carry on.

Our tournaments are force vs actor. Not force on force. We choose CQC because it is the most easily controlled. I can script out an entire scenario.

Also, I just noticed something about the first picture, the one with the battering ram. They're trying to bust in a door that opens outward, not inward. Staged pic.

[Nocte]

Yes yes, our CQC kicks a$$, etc. Bill and Adam can stop seeing red now.


The blue BDUs you guys are wearing look pretty good with the black tac gear. Great photos, lets see more of how you guys do it in Germany.

[Sleepy]

GODDAMNIT! I can't even afford the trips to Sweden and HK, and now THIS?

shazaam it, AP World Tour.

[Redmoney]

kick a$$

[Variable]

Thats some kick a$$ reenacting. I'd like to know more about how they do CQC on that side of the pond.

[ASTC Shadow]

So here some new pics:









Don't discuss to much. Enjoy the pics.

[Seagreen]

Yes yes, our CQC kicks a$$, etc. Bill and Adam can stop seeing red now.

What are you talking about Nic? We are having an intelligent discussion with Scarlett concerning reenactment/tac/mil-sim. He may not be apprised of what these events entail and investigating what he is interested in can also open new doors to future events we host.

There is nothing aggressive in nature about the dialog we are having, so please do not put that light on it. It only serves to damage an open conversation. This isn't the off-topic forum, thus only intelligent discussion is allowed.

Back to the photos:

The photos are very impressive. These photos are the type that I find to be worthy of discussion. Whether or not LAPD does wear the gear (to the exact standards) being photographed here is irrelevant. The point that they have clearly spent the time and funds to have a "movie kit" set up (read: very accurate to SWAT the movie) is truly impressive with its detail.

Well done. Excellent photos.

[RedPiano]

I wonder why he hasnt answered any of your questions.

lol it looks like they want to reenact a movie

Look at the patch on his shoulder
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000 ... ZZZZZ_.jpg

[Seagreen]

That is exactly the loadout I believe they are emulating.

[Scarlet Army]

Well here is the real thing. I'd say they are right on pace.



The photos are very impressive, even the photoshopped one with the shell casing and muzzle flash. That is a good promo shot right there! That is the type of picture that deserves a large poster.

Seagreen, it sounds like CQC has the right idea for what I would like. Just mixed with more open ended missions in an outside (or MOUT) environment. Instead of force vs. actors, make it force vs. force with actors as a third (or fourth) group.

Something along the lines of an American force, both conventional and special type units fighting against an opposing force in the opposing force's own "country." With the mix of an armed actors group acting as guerilla forces. The overall mission of the American special units is to convince guerilla forces to fight for the US side... the mission of the OPFOR unit is to eliminate the guerilla forces so they pose no threat.

It would be an op that would involve multiple missions, some occuring at the same time... but each of them having a direct effect on others that may be coming. Not to mention that it would be a 24 hour field op, even in the "base," it would be open to attack. Which means guys posting guards, etc. It would basically be a 360 degree battlefield. The threats would also be somewhat real world.

IED's on the side of roads or paths, with forces expecting to find them and render them safe. Prop wise, IED's are easy to make. Inert 105 rounds off of ebay, some clay and wires. Or a used cell phone taped to a block of clay, etc. Land mines using sound buzzers work too. All of those things can cause people to think and have 100% situational awareness at all times.

Sometimes it feels that people in airsoft are kind of mindlessly moving until they find something to shoot at. The true military tactics and missions that mil-sim should have, seem to be replaced by putting every round of your hi-cap out there.

Obviously, real cap mags. True uniforms (except for the guerilla forces) and other things. Have the players participate in coming up with the missions, participate in briefbacks to whoever is in charge of that side, etc. It would take some dedicated players and leadership to make something like that work. Plus the work up to the mission would be intense, setting all this up would be most of the battle. Plus I would think the op would need to last longer than the normal weekend, which would be a big problem for some people. But hey, it could be written off as a 4-6 day camping trip.

[PanzerFaust]

That is some amazing photog work, thanks for posting them here. I needed a new desktop background.

[RedPiano]

Well here is the real thing. I'd say they are right on pace.



The photos are very impressive, even the photoshopped one with the shell casing and muzzle flash. That is a good promo shot right there! That is the type of picture that deserves a large poster.

Seagreen, it sounds like CQC has the right idea for what I would like. Just mixed with more open ended missions in an outside (or MOUT) environment. Instead of force vs. actors, make it force vs. force with actors as a third (or fourth) group.

Something along the lines of an American force, both conventional and special type units fighting against an opposing force in the opposing force's own "country." With the mix of an armed actors group acting as guerilla forces. The overall mission of the American special units is to convince guerilla forces to fight for the US side... the mission of the OPFOR unit is to eliminate the guerilla forces so they pose no threat.

It would be an op that would involve multiple missions, some occuring at the same time... but each of them having a direct effect on others that may be coming. Not to mention that it would be a 24 hour field op, even in the "base," it would be open to attack. Which means guys posting guards, etc. It would basically be a 360 degree battlefield. The threats would also be somewhat real world.

IED's on the side of roads or paths, with forces expecting to find them and render them safe. Prop wise, IED's are easy to make. Inert 105 rounds off of ebay, some clay and wires. Or a used cell phone taped to a block of clay, etc. Land mines using sound buzzers work too. All of those things can cause people to think and have 100% situational awareness at all times.

Sometimes it feels that people in airsoft are kind of mindlessly moving until they find something to shoot at. The true military tactics and missions that mil-sim should have, seem to be replaced by putting every round of your hi-cap out there.

Obviously, real cap mags. True uniforms (except for the guerilla forces) and other things. Have the players participate in coming up with the missions, participate in briefbacks to whoever is in charge of that side, etc. It would take some dedicated players and leadership to make something like that work. Plus the work up to the mission would be intense, setting all this up would be most of the battle. Plus I would think the op would need to last longer than the normal weekend, which would be a big problem for some people. But hey, it could be written off as a 4-6 day camping trip.

I see, I saw a different patch than that when I searched.

oh well, I still think that their loadout is too shiny too be reenacting real swat though.

[Scarlet Army]

LAPD's SWAT team isn't exactly the definition of subtle. My Combat Tactics magazine did a write up on the make-up of a SWAT team, using the LAPD as a reference (this was a year or two ago)... and I couldn't believe that all that stuff was necessary to enter a building.

[RedPiano]

Im not saying that a bunch of gadgets arent necesarry, they just have this look to them that doesnt look real to me. they just look too hollywood, and they should make a video of an actual competition instead of using some stupid staged garbage to shock and awe some people.

Heres the patch I saw
http://www.geocities.com/tazcou1/images/image.gif



And since we are kind of on note, I think APs CQC events should have enemies spread out through the building instead of a few actors.(I could be wrong because ive only seen videos)

[acid]

on that picture with the brass flying, it is flying from the wrong side.