Okay, so I am looking to purchase a primary weapon for use in outdoor play to be used with a HSLD loadout; light, fast, 1337 rangar, etc.
Thing is, I don't want an AEG. I have those/had those...I am in the market to field either a nice GBBR or a GBB SMG.
Things I understand:
Less magazine capacity
Variable velocities
Lube required
Cost will generally be higher than that of an AEG
With that out of the way, I have been doing my poking around and have narrowed it down a ways:
GBBR:
G&P WOC-X (not a regular steel internal G&P WOC, G&P WOC-X with aluminium internals)
WE SCAR/MK16
WE G39C
KWA MP9/MP9R
KWA/Umarex MP7
Dual-Wielding HFC M190's (just kidding)
So, what am I looking for from you fine folks?
-Experience with the aforementioned replicas
-Pros, cons
-Major pitfalls/design flaws
And, what am I not looking for?
-Comments like "you'll never be able to pull it off" and "All those SUCK buy an Inokatsu M60"
-General trolling (unless you're cool)
Remember, I want the cost of the replica and ~3 extra magazines to be ~$350 if that is possible. If not, please tell me so I can adjust my financial plan.
Primary Weapon
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Switchback - 1337
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by icebullet » Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:34 pm
Ah, Yes... The WETTI SCAR... I've had my experience with that rifle. Steer clear. Mine currently sits at AONW wating to be repaired. Do NOT get it, I repeat; DO NOT get it.
Problems-
Mags suck (O rings, Freezing)
Crap design- (Unless you get the open bolt
)
Stock can break, mine did and it was fixed with the tightening of a screw.
Also, AONW doesn't stock it for reliability reasons.
If you must do the SCAR, do open bolt and C02.
Pro's
Look like a REAL Ranger
Black is sexy
Can be a eye catcher
Realistic mag count
Just my 2 Cents
All the others are pretty good.
Problems-
Mags suck (O rings, Freezing)
Crap design- (Unless you get the open bolt
)
Stock can break, mine did and it was fixed with the tightening of a screw.
Also, AONW doesn't stock it for reliability reasons.
If you must do the SCAR, do open bolt and C02.
Pro's
Look like a REAL Ranger
Black is sexy
Can be a eye catcher
Realistic mag count
Just my 2 Cents
All the others are pretty good.
(21:12:32) Ivan_Daylovich: It's our hate that brings us together.
Call the surgeons and tell them to take the day off, because I'll be doing all the operating now.
There's a point where this needs to stop, and we've clearly passed it
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icebullet - Soldier
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by Switchback » Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:57 pm
Yeah, I'd rather not go with a WE, but I hear their G39's and M14's are "GBBR's done right".
The more I research, the more I'm leaning to an MP9.
The more I research, the more I'm leaning to an MP9.
"I have the cutest dog."
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Switchback - 1337
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by icebullet » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:03 pm
The GandP are done right.
Apparently.. If you can find one, a WE M4 CQBR is the way to go...
But the were deemed not importable by the ATF/Customs, so that might be out of the question.
Does anyone have specs as to how far the MP9 can actually shoot? I know Bishop was using one at OP: Sundown. (I think.. It might have been a MP7)
Apparently.. If you can find one, a WE M4 CQBR is the way to go...
But the were deemed not importable by the ATF/Customs, so that might be out of the question.
Does anyone have specs as to how far the MP9 can actually shoot? I know Bishop was using one at OP: Sundown. (I think.. It might have been a MP7)
(21:12:32) Ivan_Daylovich: It's our hate that brings us together.
Call the surgeons and tell them to take the day off, because I'll be doing all the operating now.
There's a point where this needs to stop, and we've clearly passed it
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icebullet - Soldier
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by Beran » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:04 pm
from my understanding, the WE M14s have issues as well. both of the people i know of who bought them ended up selling or returning them for reliability issues.
i do love my MP9, and even though the barrel is short it has the velocity of an outdoor gun.
i do love my MP9, and even though the barrel is short it has the velocity of an outdoor gun.
Let your plans be as dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.
by Switchback » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:05 pm
Hell, I saw a guy using an MP9 at LOW II and it was pretty intimidating. Also, surprisingly effective.
"I have the cutest dog."
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by wurger » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:09 pm
I have both a WE 416 and a KWA MP7. I'll take the MP7 any day. The 416 by it's self has been OK, but, frankly, the mags suck. You have to baby the WE mags to keep them from leaking, and frequently, they leak anyway. I don't have to go very far out on the limb to say that the KWA NS2 mags are far, far, better than WE gas mags.
The range on the MP7 is longer than you would think, and the gun is just light and easy to move around the field. My only real complaint about the MP7 is that it can be a bit of a pain to find mag pouches that fit.
If you REALLY want a GBBR, my suggestion is to be patient and wait for the KWA GBBR's to finally hit the street. If the KWA GBBR's perform anything like the Mk23 I picked up today, they are going to kick butt.
If you can't wait, I have a WE 416 and 6 GG mags I'll sell you for a good price...
Just to add, one of my teammates fields a KWA MP9 every game, and loves it.
The range on the MP7 is longer than you would think, and the gun is just light and easy to move around the field. My only real complaint about the MP7 is that it can be a bit of a pain to find mag pouches that fit.
If you REALLY want a GBBR, my suggestion is to be patient and wait for the KWA GBBR's to finally hit the street. If the KWA GBBR's perform anything like the Mk23 I picked up today, they are going to kick butt.
If you can't wait, I have a WE 416 and 6 GG mags I'll sell you for a good price...
Just to add, one of my teammates fields a KWA MP9 every game, and loves it.
Last edited by wurger on Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by Beran » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:11 pm
they are easily one of the loudest GBB guns i have ever heard. there are a couple of negatives, but they are minor and easily fixed. there is a guy who posted an excellent how-to on here somewhere on taking care of those issues.
another thing you have to remember about gas guns is that using heavier BBs will actually increase relative velocity and energy. you also have the weather problem.
another thing you have to remember about gas guns is that using heavier BBs will actually increase relative velocity and energy. you also have the weather problem.
Let your plans be as dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.
by Haloeclipse » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:23 pm
Love my umarex mp7. Ill have it with me at Fallout if you want to finger shazaam it. Nice noise, looks hot, reaches out and touches people in their no no parts. All in all very enjoyable.
Never ever insult Halo he is a god among men ~achillesnick~
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by Miracle » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:47 pm
All around good guns that need little maintenance and few upgrades to be reliable skirmishers:
-KWA/Umarex MP7
-KWA/KSC MP9
-WETTI AWSS M4A1 (AWSS on CO2 for washington weather, not the regular WE M4A1)
-WE HK416 (you wont be able to find it but they are great little pieces)
-WE Open bolt PDW (My favorite on this list, and my reccomendation)
-WE G36C (Some bolt issues after dumping mags, but negligible)
-Sun Project/ Asahi M4's on Exterior rigs (will always run well no matter what the weather, but it will be ridiculously to find someone willing to part with it and you don't have the technical know how to keep it maintained).
-KJW M4A1 (velocity reducer is a pain to install but is a super reliable system with steel in all the right places)
Rifles that will need lots of TLC and will have a hard time year round in Washington:
-ANYTHING WA SYSTEM, Don't get me wrong, I love WA's (G&P, AGM, Inoktasu, Bomber, Vipertech, King Arms, MOST of the KWA/KSC system are all WA system) and they are the only Gas Guns that I continue to own, an Inokatsu and a G&P WOC/Inokatsu. I have owned pretty much every gas primary at one time or another, and WA is by far the most upgradable and most fun of the bunch once you spend the time to get it shooting correctly. But you WILL replace lots of parts, and you WILL have lots of finicky little problems, and the cold PNW weather WILL keep you from running your GBBRs outside for 7 months out of the year. These guns are not entry level, and to be honest you shouldn't buy one because you haven't owned any other GBBRs yet and you don;t even know what its like to try and use them as a primary. It sucks 75% of the time, and it is the most fun you've ever had the other 25%.
-Guns to stay away from:
AGM
King Arms
WE Open Bolt M4s
WE SCARs
WELL
The only caveat on this list is the WE open bolt M4, the only reason you should stay away is that they are plauged with the same issues as standard WA systems, and for the same price you can buy a decent WA base gun as well.
I suggest the WE Open Bolt PDW. Great little blaster, have owned one, sold it,a nd have regretted it ever since. Runs great on CO2 mags, and runs on WE open bolt M4 mags, which are 20 bucks cheaper than the most reliable WA system mags for the price, GHK (at around 65)
-KWA/Umarex MP7
-KWA/KSC MP9
-WETTI AWSS M4A1 (AWSS on CO2 for washington weather, not the regular WE M4A1)
-WE HK416 (you wont be able to find it but they are great little pieces)
-WE Open bolt PDW (My favorite on this list, and my reccomendation)
-WE G36C (Some bolt issues after dumping mags, but negligible)
-Sun Project/ Asahi M4's on Exterior rigs (will always run well no matter what the weather, but it will be ridiculously to find someone willing to part with it and you don't have the technical know how to keep it maintained).
-KJW M4A1 (velocity reducer is a pain to install but is a super reliable system with steel in all the right places)
Rifles that will need lots of TLC and will have a hard time year round in Washington:
-ANYTHING WA SYSTEM, Don't get me wrong, I love WA's (G&P, AGM, Inoktasu, Bomber, Vipertech, King Arms, MOST of the KWA/KSC system are all WA system) and they are the only Gas Guns that I continue to own, an Inokatsu and a G&P WOC/Inokatsu. I have owned pretty much every gas primary at one time or another, and WA is by far the most upgradable and most fun of the bunch once you spend the time to get it shooting correctly. But you WILL replace lots of parts, and you WILL have lots of finicky little problems, and the cold PNW weather WILL keep you from running your GBBRs outside for 7 months out of the year. These guns are not entry level, and to be honest you shouldn't buy one because you haven't owned any other GBBRs yet and you don;t even know what its like to try and use them as a primary. It sucks 75% of the time, and it is the most fun you've ever had the other 25%.
-Guns to stay away from:
AGM
King Arms
WE Open Bolt M4s
WE SCARs
WELL
The only caveat on this list is the WE open bolt M4, the only reason you should stay away is that they are plauged with the same issues as standard WA systems, and for the same price you can buy a decent WA base gun as well.
I suggest the WE Open Bolt PDW. Great little blaster, have owned one, sold it,a nd have regretted it ever since. Runs great on CO2 mags, and runs on WE open bolt M4 mags, which are 20 bucks cheaper than the most reliable WA system mags for the price, GHK (at around 65)
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by league 4 » Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:19 pm
I wouldn't really consider GHK mags more reliable than ProWin mags... Especially with the plastic feed lips. But, as long as you have a backup AEG, a WOC will be fine for use. I'd recommend saving up and getting a standard WOC (not X) if possible.
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by Lunchbox » Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:32 pm
Poebot wrote:Ah, Yes... The WETTI SCAR... I've had my experience with that rifle. Steer clear. Mine currently sits at AONW wating to be repaired. Do NOT get it, I repeat; DO NOT get it.
Problems-
Mags suck (O rings, Freezing)
Crap design- (Unless you get the open bolt
Stock can break, mine did and it was fixed with the tightening of a screw.
Also, AONW doesn't stock it for reliability reasons.
If you must do the SCAR, do open bolt and C02.
Pro's
Look like a REAL Ranger
Black is sexy
Can be a eye catcher
Realistic mag count
Just my 2 Cents
All the others are pretty good.
I disagree with just about all of this, I have 10 mags that work great and do not leak at all. Never had a problem with any of my internals, but all the major parts have been upgraded to steel parts, I use propane and the only thing I am missing is the open bolt. Never had any externals break on me great solid feel
G.O.A.T.
Thomas Gabriel: On your tombstone it should say "Always in the wrong place at the wrong time".
John McClane: How about "Yippi-kay-ay, meanie"
Thomas Gabriel: On your tombstone it should say "Always in the wrong place at the wrong time".
John McClane: How about "Yippi-kay-ay, meanie"
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Lunchbox - Specops
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by icebullet » Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:15 pm
Lunchbox wrote:Poebot wrote:Ah, Yes... The WETTI SCAR... I've had my experience with that rifle. Steer clear. Mine currently sits at AONW wating to be repaired. Do NOT get it, I repeat; DO NOT get it.
Problems-
Mags suck (O rings, Freezing)
Crap design- (Unless you get the open bolt
Stock can break, mine did and it was fixed with the tightening of a screw.
Also, AONW doesn't stock it for reliability reasons.
If you must do the SCAR, do open bolt and C02.
Pro's
Look like a REAL Ranger
Black is sexy
Can be a eye catcher
Realistic mag count
Just my 2 Cents
All the others are pretty good.
I disagree with just about all of this, I have 10 mags that work great and do not leak at all. Never had a problem with any of my internals, but all the major parts have been upgraded to steel parts, I use propane and the only thing I am missing is the open bolt. Never had any externals break on me great solid feel
Everyone's entitled to their opinion. I had one of the older SCAR's, and I was a total noob when it came to maintaining it
(21:12:32) Ivan_Daylovich: It's our hate that brings us together.
Call the surgeons and tell them to take the day off, because I'll be doing all the operating now.
There's a point where this needs to stop, and we've clearly passed it
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