NWAC Presents Sacrifice 03/30/08 Mc Gowen Creek, OR

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Postby Doubleks » Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:39 am

That was a long post?

So it was a good game overall. I felt that the scenarios were good in basic design. I wasn't up to speed with the airstrikes, napalm, nanobots, UAV's etc. but if people find that sort of thing enjoyable then more power to them. I could tell that quite a few players felt that it distracted from the overall gameplay, but for people who had been in the campaign and had fought for those dollars that they were spending on UAV's and such that may have added another element to the game play. I think that some small amount of those things would have been good but only if the complexity was low and if the usage was well understood by all. Most of the briefings appears to take place on the web before hand and despite my best efforts to use the funky forum I never saw the map before I was on the field, etc. What happens when only a couple are briefed is that command gets shot and anarchy ensues. All participants deserve an equal share of the information.

I think that to get more AP players at these kinds of events there should be some kind of middle ground between the events of the campaign and the one-day players from AP. I would have immensely appreciated some kind of "AP Briefing Package" for those people who don't have the time to keep up with the campaign on the web yet still want to attend the event and know what the heck is going on. Sounds like Clown is already headed in that direction and I appreciate it.

Positives:

-Being able to operate with one team throughout the day.
-Playing on a course I haven't played on much with lots of natural terrain and cover.
-Running against Attack37 and his shiny new toy
-Seeing innovative new airsoft features like UAV's.
-Working with new, less experience airsoft players (yes this is under positives)
-Getting to set three ambushes in one day.

Not-so-positives:

-Inconsistency in information from admins, also a mix up in sector assignments.
-People not calling hit even though they were hit and were in the process of going out. They just don't do anything at first, no yell, no hand, and never a deathrag. Just a slow trudge away.
-Off-field stuff having an impact on the field. My CO told me that he had a hit out on him (from off the field, spending credits or some such) and that he counter-offered on the field. I guess had he not won the counter offer he would have just been killed by an admin and removed from play.
-Close-range sniper engagements. I saw someone on my team get shot with an assaulting bolt at a range of no less than 20 yards (crossroads to the trench).
-Lack of briefings. There was no overall briefing, only team briefings at starting points. Our particular admin glossed over safety matters in the briefing as if they were old news when my team had no fewer than 4 players who were in their first airsoft game ever.

Overall, none of the problems I saw were that different from things that happen at other games.

Major props to the new players on Cryo. I am sure that your opponents had no idea how many airsoft games you had played in because y'all were dishing it out. I really like working with new players because in many ways they are not yet spoiled or jaded. Some of the things they were doing are things that even the vets can take lessons from. Without any orders from command they were using runners to keep a link between the front line and the back line, reacting/investigating situations that were possible threats not just confirmed threats, sitting on defensive watch for a long time in the cold with no errant fire and little talking, and just generally not being jackasses.

On a final note, as the person who was on the other side of the above discussed Vamps charge I took great delight in being able to just target down one pipe and get you all. This is not only because the gun I was using was new and hungry but also because my position apparently had great lines of fire with little exposure. I was having so much fun I switched to semi. :) If it's any consolation Vamps and the rest of them fell as well after the initial charge. If you had advanced as a line instead of as a column you would have had me. Admittedly you probably didn't know I was the only one there at the time and were probably trying to keep your exposure low, it was just unfortunate that the advance was right down my line of fire. After that I repositioned to the left and the assaulting force regrouped and charged. That was an awesome charge. It was a broad line that crossed the road all at once running and firing and as soon as I identified my position by firing I had no fewer than 2 people RUNNING at me to get me. It was an awesome demonstration of how to use superior numbers and I felt quite powerless and gaffled.

Good game, thanks to NWAC for putting it on. I would encourage AP players to check out these games as this group is really trying to do some next level things not typically seen in airsoft.
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Postby vamps » Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:02 pm

Wait what? I missed that in the first post.
Fridge are you talking about the Springer?
Okay hold. I didn't know you never found it. I gave it to your one of your friends. He said he'd get it to you. Some where in there a wire got crossed.

Also Fridge, next time something like this happens TELL the person that the pistol is missing, and that the guy he gave it to no longer has it.
Once I told you that one of them (I'm pretty sure it was the M16 or the guy with the Radio) had it I assumed you got it back it because you did not mention it again.



Yeah thats kind of messed up fridge if you knew it was missing you should have brought it up to me at the game not here. I over heard you all talk about you own man loosing it and how it wasn't a big deal let it drop. and now you are blaming Vamp? I don't think so.

And so you know you said that you are an airsofter on a budget. I have to tell you, you are in the wrong game. If a 5 dollar springer is a budget. I'll be honest you might want to find a different sport or a better Job.
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Now from my understanding he picked it up. So you should still, have it. I have no problem replacing it, but dude don't turn around telling the guy that said "Yeah I'll get it to him hes right behind me" its fine it dropped and then attempt to pin it on someone. That is kinda messed up. Also if this is true I don't care if its just a springer it fell at his feet, if hes to lazy to bend over and pick it up I might start to reevaluate my friends. That throw placed it right at his hand it hit and dropped in front of him.
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Postby 1SGTTank » Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:59 pm

OK so I am the CEO of the Atomic team. I am shocked that this is going on.

5 men my self included were the ones that took most if not all of those bases. Fridge and his boys would hardly do anything. Often times going off and doing what they wanted at the sacrifice of the team. This was a competition and our team needed to win this.

this is my post in response to Fridge's review

I can agree that was a bit out of place. but in all honesty, I like you guys but as far as command went it was very hard to get you guys to do what we needed. Vamp is a hard a$$ but one of the nicest guys on the field. He was very much responding to my stress in the fact that we could not get you all to do what we were asking. When we say move up we don't mean run out and expose yourself to the enemy or move 3 feet forward and hide. As you did many times. I could visually see you all just standing around in the open were the enemy had a direct line of site or behind me like in the first firefight. I was frustrated in that when I would ask you to do something I was either ignored, or you just did what you wanted kind of listening.

Vamp was holding back because he was second in command and I was down. If you noticed I was many times all the way in the back also. But that is were we need to be. Command is suppose to be protected. How many times did you see the my back side in a fire fight? and I am not talking about in formation.

To add to that vamp was at the front of almost every assault on those bases. While you all were not. I can say the same thing. Most of the time you were be hind me when we finally engaged the enemy.

One more thing.... Vamp would not shoot you in the head. I heard him he was not being serious. He said he would shoot you. you would not do what he was asking or listen he was getting stressed out. atomic will not have an epic fail and that is not your place to decide that.

So thank you all for this review. I do not believe any of this was needed if you have an issue with someone in atomic or is command please PM me directly.

I will ask vamp to lighten up though as I do see what you all are getting at.

So we don't end on a bad note I want you all to be part of the team and be happy. I will do my best to have you under your own mens commands. but you are all under me. If I say form on my 6 it doesn't mean till you deem needed to change that command, it stays that way till I say other wise.

Atomic has won almost every game in sacrifice, mainly because our guys get along, are highly organized and we fight to win. You have not only brought down Atomics name on another forum you have talked down about Sacrifice. I am unimpressed with your child like behavior and the need to go pout.

P.S. There is a reason why people from other teams keep leaving theirs and coming to Atomic. So I want this to end. If you do not stop your winning you will be looking for employment else where


Sorry for the Long post guys. I had hoped that my first words on this Forum would be asking you all to be part of Atomic.


Oh and Sorry for the close range shot. I was told 60 feet minimum and I believe I was at that. I set my scope so I can use the ranger finder and target size to identify my distance.
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Postby Redmoney » Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:28 pm

being the CEO of another company i can understand where tank is comming from, i have been fighting to keep my numbers at a competitive rate, but too many people are saying how eager they are and they will be there for sure, then they bail, or fight with another team(those of you know who im talking about) with out notifieing me, not only is that extreamly aggravating, but changing teams at an event is not alowed during Sacrafice. out of the 8 guys that showed up for my team, four of them had never played befor, and i have to say that they showed more balls, and way more sportsmanship and honesty then alot of more experienced players i know, and thank you to DoubleKs and Eclipse for helping me steer them on the right path and just helping me out in general yesterday. i really appriciate it
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Postby Deleteplz » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:41 pm

Just an FYI: PSC hadn't chosen a team to run with, Redmoney assumed that we were to run with Cryotech, this was false, and is still incorrect to this day.



Red: Please remove your head from your a$$, thank you.



Tank: PSC will not be work with your company ether.


Have a nice day!
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Postby 1SGTTank » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:04 pm

Honestly you all should take over manic so we have more teams running full bore. I don't have a problem with anyone. I just don't like having my team or people talked about unjustly. Thats all
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Postby Pope_Alex_Kaeda_I » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:13 pm

Altair wrote: In my personal opinion, vamps orders get people killed.
I'm often the loud-mouth in charge. My orders get people killed. Thats the shitty thing about being a loud-mouth in charge. Someone's going to end up being pissed off because you barked at them to put their a$$ in gear and get into the fight.

i wasn't at this event, and I've never been under Vamps command. I do, however, know that when a unit gets decimated, its because the commander was inept, and when a unit scores big - its because the troops were brilliant.

How many people died needlessly because I was throwing troops around trying to absorb the gunfire from Blue Platoon, and Red Platoon this past weekend at Silents skirmish? How many of those people came away thinking I'm the biggest jackass ever? shazaam it. We held on to the blue flag for a long damn time - and we did with the 'blood' of the Yellow team. We bought and paid for that flag. I'm proud to say that I rolled with Yellow Team.

Vamps orders got people killed. My orders get people killed. Welcome to Airsoft. Some body has to die, and you really didn't want to live forever anyways.


EDIT: Altair's post disappeared before mine was posted. :-p
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Postby 1SGTTank » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:22 pm

Very true however there were times as I can see now that vamps orders were not the best. But we really wanted to get the game over with. it was the last base of the day. You also expect that when you say advance your men would chose a good way to advance and not mindlessly run straight out into gun fire. But who cares I commanded most of the day and atomic did really well.

Nice thing about real war vs milsim. Once they are dead they don't post on the forums and complain.
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Postby Fridge » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:41 pm

Look guys, if you read my post I said that I dont care that the pistol was lost, I KNOW IT WAS A CHEAP PISTOL, so chill out, its not like im pissed off or anything about it, but from what I was told, you tossed it to him and it fell to the ground, I gave the pistol to you to use so therefor it is your responsilibility to get it back to me. But dude, you dont owe me a pistol or anything, I never said that, other people did, so chill, I had a good time, and I think overall everyone did.

And my pouting and what not, dude, as I said alot in my review, I am not mad nor sad or anything, I was just pointing out stuff, it doesnt really matter if I said "Vamps lost my pistol." Oh well, big deal, I can get over it. And I understand that every leader sends people to death and what not....just vamps did it alot, and in my personal opinion, we did what we were told, Vamps told me to run, I ran, Vamps told me to go through the bushes I did, you all told us to get into a "Triangle" we did, so please dont say that we didnt do what you said, or that we did our own thing, cause we didnt. Also, the ONE time we tried to do something else, WE TOOK THE BASE that time...so I am just saying that it wasnt Vamps fault for anything, or Tanks or ours...

I have no hard feelings, and this all should be droped
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Postby Novoselic » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:19 pm

From my understanding with Renagade, PSC will be running with manic next game, and we will be sure to work that out with them. I hope the other teams the best of luck, I really do.
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Postby Kenji Yasaka » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:29 pm

I had fun working with tank and often Vamps. I learned many things and even got somthing else.. a callsign! (Runner)

I messed up a couple of times, and so did the CO's, we are human so get over that. The cold was messing up much more then just our guns.

The airstrike/arty often worked well, and somtimes it did'nt, just like real warfare!

The game ran so well that I did not even guess the game was suppose to be a milsim. It seems like most of the teams had a structure to them so it was great fighting aginst organised resistance.

Overall GREAT fun.
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Postby KA-BAR » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:36 pm

#1 i was not at this game.

#2 i NEVER loan gear to ANYONE.

#3 Vamps is not a ninja or a good commander.

ill tell you what, if i did ( not like its going to ever happen!) loan ANYONE a piece of gear, and instead of returning it to me, they tossed it my way on the field, and considered that " the solution" is a complete and utter irresponsible fucktard.



sounds like it was a so-so game also.
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Postby tempist » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:57 pm

i am 1 of 2on the comand eliments in nsa and i give alsorts of comands it is what i do and what i did in the usmc i like it and my troops fallow them cuz that is there job how ever my troops also respect me and will do what i say because i have a bigger plan that involves victory O and it takes balls to tell peeps that you dont know what to do so i give vamps props the outcome is they won
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Postby Novoselic » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:10 pm

tempist wrote:i am 1 of 2on the comand eliments in nsa and i give alsorts of comands it is what i do and what i did in the usmc i like it and my troops fallow them cuz that is there job how ever my troops also respect me and will do what i say because i have a bigger plan that involves victory O and it takes balls to tell peeps that you dont know what to do so i give vamps props the outcome is they won


"I am 1 of 2 on the command elements in the NSA, I give all sorts of commands. It is what I do and what I did in the USMC. I like it and my troops follow them because that is their job. However, my troops also respect me and will do what I say because I have a bigger plan that involves victory. Oh and it takes balls to tell people that you don't know what to do so I give vamps props. The outcome is that they won. " - FIXED


Okay, I have great respect that you were in the marines, but for the love of god please, please work on your grammar. It's killing me, really. It's a big thing on AP to have good grammar, which I learned when I first came.
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Postby Fridge » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:15 pm

uh.....yeah >_>
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